Our conversation with Tigran Khzmalyan, the famous film director and script writer who until recently held the position of director of the "Yerevan" film studio took place the day after his return from London where he participated in an Armenian film festival. For this reason we asked him to share his impressions of how the festival went.

The festival of Armenian film in London lasted for over a week and it was not a festival in the sense we are used to i.e. nominated films and prizes. As the organisers said, this was the first Armenian film panorama in the past 25 years. The French Consulate assisted the festival providing the "Lumier" cinema house in their cultural centre in Kensington for the screening of films by Armenian directors from the Diaspora and Armenia as well as "Vodka lemon" which was shot in Armenia by the Kurdish Director, Khavil Salem. This film was nominated for an Oscar in the category of best international film.

The Diaspora was represented by the directors Serj Avetikyan and Lion Minasyan (France), by producer and actress Nora Armani, film director Karine Torosyan and Atom Egoyan (Canada). From Armenia, Don Askaryan and Harutyun Khachatryan were represented by the films "Terminal" and "Return to the promised land", the name of which became the slogan of festival. There were also two of my films, "Perlekino or lighter than air" which opened the festival and "Lovember" which closed it. There were also retrospective showings of the pick of Armenian film. The first was "Colour of Pomegranates," and the second day was dedicated to the work of Artavazd Peleshyan.

Apart from that, two round tables took place in the framework of the festival. One concerned the theme of Genocide in Armenian film in connection to the 90 th anniversary of the Armenian Genocide and the second was about the work and collaboration of the two parts of Armenian film in the Diaspora and Armenia as well as collaboration between Armenian film directors. The organisers, press and the audience received the festival well, specifically mentioning that through the efforts of the organisers and as a result of the talent of those creating, the treasures of one of the lesser known national cultures that were hidden until now were disclosed.

Not much is known about what is happening during recent years in Armenian cinematography, even in Armenia . Audiences here and abroad prefer Western blockbusters and action movies. Armenian films not generally shown in the cinemas and if they are, they rarely fill the hall. At the same time, you affirm that our national cinematography attracted significant interest inEngland.

In reality our cinematography is having more and more influence. This may seem strange but it's true. In London I bought a book published by the Germans dedicated to Artavazd Peleshyan. Three hundred pages of the book are full of photos from Peleshyan's films, some of which are reproduced from the original film. Very few directors in the world enjoy this sort of dignity. No American blockbuster has been reproduced from the original film because everyone understands who will kill or sleep with who. But the films of Peleshyan are art and there is demand for it. Or let's take Paradjanov. He is one of the Gods in cinematography to whom people pray. In Armenia , this is admittedly less so but everyone working in the field of cinematography knows there is Paradjanov, Peleshyan.

All your films are dissimilar to each other and also to what we are used to seeing in Armenian films. You speak about people, love, hatred, personal feelings. How do human experiences and national features correlate in your heroes?

I think about national features when I am making feature films. I complete the film and it turns out however it does. My heroes are ballet dancers, clowns, prostitutes, vagrants and others as worse as you can imagine. However, they are completely normal people. Who do they need to be? Bankers, businessmen?! Yes, they also are there, but you need to love your heroes so something comes out of them. I don't like bankers and businessmen.

But in your documentaries the national character is felt rather distinctly. The majority of them are about people whom we could consider national heroes.

I have my own opinion on this. We were born in a country where politics and ideology dominated over the culture and that is why artists, film directors and writers to the extent that was possible resisted ideological pressure. Now the situation has paradoxically changed. There is no pressure from the state and in fact the situation is vice a versa. The pressure comes because of absolute indifference. There is no ideology. The paradox is that when I now make films I consciously touch upon ideology. I am making something close to propaganda about my country about my nation.

To tell ourselves about each other or to inform others about us?

I understand very distinctly when I am making a film for who I am doing so. There is a sort of stamp in Russian journalism that deals with where we came from and where are we going. For example, I made a film about Tigran Petrosyan called "The Death of the King". After Petrosyan became the world chess champion many boys were named after him, including me and so it was very interesting for me to make a film about the person after whom I was named. On 20 May 1963 when he won a match against Botvinnik to become champion of world, Armenians for the first time gathered in the square and celebrated. You can't not make a film about this. In reality, the film is not only about Petrosyan but also about that part of our history when that person returned self-respect to people who were otherwise broken.

Later, in 1973, Armenians again had reason to celebrate when the "Ararat" football team won the cup in the championship of the Soviet Union . Again this is material for another documentary film about a country, politics, psychology, ideology and about football because at that time, it was one of the few ways to express national feelings. This was also very interesting for me. This is how films were born out of pure ideology.

I also made a film about Mount Ararat , "5165," and Baroness Cox, "Sister of Mercy." I also made a film about the Theatre Square in 1988, "Forgotten February." This film was made with Arman Melikyan representing the "breath" of the songs and speeches from the square and with the photographer Zaven Khachikyan. On the basis of their material I made a photo film which the English consider to be my best documentary project. I also made films about Peleshyan, Ruben Hakhverdyan and Aram Khachatryan. I like making documentary films because there is no place for you. You are providing the place for others and expressing yourself when it comes to the final choice made for the material. That is why films are individual and subjective and I have seen how they deeply touch people. I was happy to show them in the Armenian community of Montreal and Toronto where people cried although I understand that this was not my achievement. I just provided the audience with the opportunity.

Even if you make a film about certain person again it is about the period of time?

Yes, it about the time manifested through people and also, it is interesting to examine how they change with time. Documentary film-making provides a tremendous opportunity to follow the changes not just in one person, although that type of film is also excellent, but also of a nation at a particular period in time. Films reveal the layers that make up a person as well as the layers that make up time. To play with this is possible not only in film. The best literature also achieves the same. Tolstoy played with nations and states in his novels but film provides an excellent opportunity to see it.

Who is your audience? Do you feel that your films are understood when you show them in other countries?

I absolutely feel it, of course. I feel that a specific structure of minds, hearts and souls unites us. My audience are people who need each other because they are interested in what similarities and what differences there are between people. They are people for whom art is the most important thing in life or let's not say the most important. In actual fact the main thing in life is kindness, love and compassion. However, there is an accumulated expression of all of this and that is art. For me, film is the life from which everything unnecessary is cut. It is life abbreviated to one and half hours. The director has the power at the editing table to cut everything and to leave just one and half hours. This is called film, but it is also general life. Here all human drama is accumulated as well as everything that makes us human. In this we are similar but at the same time different. When I share this it is interesting for people who came to watch my films. They become close to me. When you start reading books or go to watch films to compare your life with others, to change it for at least for two hours, to find answers or to ask yourself questions, it is not at all important what language the person speaks. May be that's why I also make films without words or commentary so that nothing separates the subject and the audience and nothing prevents them from watching my film.

What in your opinion do other nationalities and cultures find interesting in Armenian cinematography?

In the whole world the situation is similar. When I meet people from Europe and North America the first few minutes of the conversation is taken up by curiosity shown towards the person from another culture with other language. This comes from the desire to understand how we are different from each other and what we have in common. At the beginning, we open with what is different and then, we find out what is relative to both of us - on the surface, difference but in depth, a similarity with other people. This approach is absolutely universal and is what unites us with nature in general and with the world. The world on the surface is alien and hostile but when you pay with your heart, your time, soul and patience, you understand how this place is close to you. It becomes yours. The person on whom you spend your soul, time and heart becomes understandable for you. This also concerns books, film and country. At the beginning you are shocked by loneliness and difference with everything you knew and loved and then that in-depth correspondence with the main rule of life.

You speak about Europe and America . How are things in the "near abroad" with our neighbours? Do we know each other, is it enough and is there interest in general to each other?

There is a feeling that the South Caucasus is at least a region. In the West we are considered more or less one region and the paradox and drama is that we are not that. We are not one either in economic or in the cultural and psychological respect. When we talk about these three countries - Armenia , Georgia and Azerbaijan - the main thing that occurs to me is this strange circumstance. The strange thing is that we have lived here for a long time and influenced each other. I can assure you that now, Paris and Los Angeles are "closer" than Baku and Tbilisi . We stopped interesting each other and we know very little about what's happening in the economic, cultural, political life of our close neighbours. Of course, there are people who are especially working on this but the kind of separation that is happening now I can't personally remember beforehand. The paradox is that this is happening together along with the inevitable process of globalisation. Youth dress similarly in the three countries to a certain extent, listen to the same music and dance the same dances while also similarly, don't read books, eat the same food and have the same interests and objectives in life. But these objectives are unbelievably pragmatic compared to our youth when it wasn't the most important thing for us to dress nicely and to have material welfare. We left after us not only broken hopes and illusions but also some good books, songs, films but now, in front of our eyes, the ability to create dies and sustains the hunger of consumption in the once very creative nations of the South Caucasus .

Is this a problem?

Yes, and not only for the South Caucasus but also for the whole world because it is ruled by small number of people in a small number of countries who are trying to turn the rest of the world into a market for consuming their goods. This completely suppresses creativeness, spiritual values and culture which always seemed to me, and especially now, the only important thing. The rest in terms of the state of the economy, politics and geography are secondary because we remember society where there are ideals, right or wrong, that were based on compassion to our friends, care for the weak and respect for culture, and not on the "rule of flock" to destroy the misfortunate, to trample down the weak and gnaw out a fat portion with our teeth.

Do you think that lack of the contacts with nations and cultures on the regional level impoverishes us or we can survive without each other?

Before, when the Georgians or Azerbaijanis did something, we wanted to do it even better. The same was true for them when, we did something in culture, sport, art, cinematography. This is healthy coexistence. We couldn't be indifferent to each other because we played on the same field. Thirteen years ago we played in the same team but now this doesn't exist. Alienation in this sense is killing because somehow we went back to zero and each one is discovering the tricycle and everyone goes round and round in a circle. It is not obligatory to compete with Georgian or Azerbaijani nations although it is possible to compete with the French, Americans and Iranians. Everyone has their choice but it is apparent that we lived with each other and in each other like interlaced fingers. This undoubtedly reigned over everyone because we added to one another what was lacking.

Is it possible to overcome this separation?

We really are alienated from each other and I am sure that the only thing that can unite us is art. Only that can revive interest among us. We are still interested in what is new in Georgian cinematography and we are still not indifferent to the other. For better or worse, we sailed in the same boat and in the same direction. Those who are coming after us now lack the experience of coexistence. For them, Germany , France and America are actually more understandable and closer than Georgia , Azerbaijan and Turkey but if we lose this ring we will have to rebuild from zero because there won't be anything that unites us. This is terrible. Our generation symbolized this link in the meetings which I saw - the remarkable Armenian writer, Hrant Matevosyan, a remarkable script writer and director, Rustam Ibrahimbekov and the fantastic Russian prose writer, Andrey Bitov, being guests of the excellent Georgian script writer and director, Rezo Gabridze. They were interesting for each other. They were friends. But now, Hrant Matevosyan is dead, Rustam Ibrahimbekov resides in Moscow and Rezo Gabridze show his performances mainly to foreigners because in the current Georgia, the time is not right for the puppet performances that Gabridze excelled at.

You participated in conferences in Tbilisi . Was something similar created via contacts with your colleagues?

Yes, of course, although we need more than memorial. Together with some Armenian directors I took part in one Swiss project which financed few Armenian, Georgian and Azerbaijani films - feature films, documentary films, feature-length and short. There I met some Georgian and Azerbaijani colleagues engaged in cinematography and I think it will always be pleasant for us to meet and interesting to see who is doing what. It is strange, though. Swiss money was needed for this and rather a large amount. It is true that in this sense, I was not a typical example because in London I gladly met my old Azerbaijani friend, Famil Ismailov. Now he lives and works in London . The next generation doesn't have the experience of this type of friendship and some separate visits of journalists and film directors hardly helps. Quality is needed which later will have a quantity. If this doesn't happen we'll finally turn into what we are increasingly becoming - a small region of the globe paradoxically separated and connected with whoever you can imagine - with New Zealand more than with our neighbours, for example, because this is profitable for the politicians.

But life is very serious thing to trust to politicians. Artists consciously or subconsciously fight for people. They fight with politicians. Now they are losing that war. On the screens of TV, on the pages of the newspapers and books are politics, deputies, businessmen and thieves merging into politics and coming out from politics, members of Parliament with a criminal past, future and present but not the people who were the heroes of our generation - the scientists, artists, film directors and actors. We know who is killed in Georgia or who is imprisoned in Azerbaijan or who is beaten up in Armenia but we don't know who and what was written, filmed or photographed. There is no way to know. No one writes, films or shows it. Even under the rubric "Culture" in general there are out culture articles about how the political order is maintained by this or that figure but nothing at all about ethics, eutectics, art, not about how it is new, old, untalented or grey. This is how it is.

Of course, this also happened before. In the favourable in the cultural sense and disgusting in political sense 1970-80s, Avet Terteryan went to live on the coast of Sevan so that he didn't have to listen to all this rubbish. He needed to listen to the space to write his music but we are mortal, weak and sinful. Apart from space we also need a television signal but what do we get through these signals?! I went to Georgia and watched Georgian television. Again, it was complete mess and political intrigues . Is it interesting for people? Why to feed them only with this? There is also another type of food. If you feed humans only with this, they get used to it and will think that there is nothing else. Something similar happens in Armenia and also, I think, in Azerbaijan . I saw Turkish television and it is disgusting and terrible. I saw Italian television when I lived in Italy and I was shocked. The country which gave the world the Renaissance! This is a global problem and not only one that afflicts our region.

What can we do about this? What you are talking about is a process which has taken over the whole world - globalisation!

Parajanov is a genius not only in terms of art. He also turned out to be a fantastic prophet. It wasn't in vain that he made films in Armenia , Georgia and Azerbaijan . He made a film in Azerbaijan at the peak, as we now understand, of hatred and war. In 1988-1989 he filmed "Ashik Kerib" based on Turkish and Azerbaijani material in the Azerbaijani language. He made another fantastic film, "Legend of Suram fortress," based absolutely on Georgian material. In some way he repeated the way of his idol, Sayat- Nova, and the monument in which three women are depicted in Armenian, Georgian and Turkish national costumes. The idea of the monument is the fate of Sayat Nova who existed in three dimensions, in three cultures. And, let's say Charles Aznavour and Michel Legran who are Armenians by nationality do not in vain come back to their origins by singing Sayat- Nova in particular. Why Sayat- Nova? Because he is open for the world. This is the best example of globalisation. Art is the best mean of globalisation. Without fighting, when people think the same way and eat the same thing, and when world globalisation in the sense of tolerance and internal freedom allows the freedom of the person, art can't be national. This is a vicious stupidity. Culture can be national but not art. Art is always above the national. I made a film where I used music from Prokofiev's ballet, "Romeo and Juliet." So, an Italian story in the poems of an English writer and the music of a Russian composer in the film of an Armenian film director. What am I? Aram Khachatryan, the great music of the Armenian composer on the libretto of the Italian writer, Jovanoli, performed by the Russian ballet in the Bolshoi theatre. What is this? Russian, Armenian, Italian. This is art. It is human. This is exactly what makes us human.

There is an absolutely great photographer who is ethnically Armenian, Ara Guller. He is called the live symbol of Istanbul . Of course, in Turkey no one mentions that he is an Armenian but they worship him and there is the cult of Ara Guller. He is very famous all over the world. He shot the portraits of many famous and great people. He photographed Churchill, Fellini, Sofi Loren and Brigit Bardot but his most famous work is of Istanbul starting from middle of the last century. In 1960, he was the first to photograph the statutes of Gods - Armenian Gods - on the Mountain of Nemrut . He was also the first when he was charged with the task by the Turkish Army of photographing what is considered the remnants of Noah's Ark. Most of all, he was proud of these two photographs because these two features opened up the world for him. I filmed him for a documentary film about Turkey and this is what he said." No need to confuse the flags under which we live, the language we speak with the heart that beats in the same way in everyone when the colour of our blood is the same. An artist belongs to the world that understands and loves him and not this or that nation."

Yelena Kurdiyan, Gagik Tadevosyan

South Caucasus . Monthly Magazine 
www.caucasusjournalists.net